The Great Debate (quick)

The same-sex marriage debate at CSU-Pueblo was very interesting last night.  The 2 debators were a professor of philosophy from Wayne State U (for) and an author and former (or current) employee of Focus on the Family (against).  They spoke and then each rebutted the other a couple of times.  They do this regularly across the country.  They managed to keep things very civil (so did the audience) and really not bring “God” into it at all. They were clear that they were speaking in terms of civil, legal marriage versus anything that happens in a church.  After they spoke, they opened up the floor for questions.

The audience contained a good number of students, but also folks from the community including a recently-elected county commissioner which I thought was interesting.  He didn’t ask any questions.

As might be expected, most of the questions were for the guy who was against same-sex marriage.  All his speech was really quoting from various scholarly texts about the “stabilizing” influence of marriage on men, because of women, etc., etc., blah, blah.  I don’t mean to make light of him (well maybe I do) but I mean, quoting works from 1962??  Please.

Anyway, in the question section, one young man came forward and asked a telling question, saying that if this man thought marriage was such a stabilizing influence in humanity, why was it BAD if 2 HUMAN BEINGS decided to enter into a marriage relationship.

“Well, it’s not,” said the anti-gay-marriage speaker.

“So, are you then saying that gay and lesbian people aren’t human?” asked the young man.

Let me tell you, there was dead silence in that ballroom.  I vividly remember the other speaker turning his head to his opponent and looking at him like, Let’s see you get out of THIS.

And, you know, he couldn’t.  He was totally stumped for a good 3 or 4 beats, and then started hemming and hawing and, well, if the PEOPLE are male and female…etc.

But the underlying thoughts had been revealed.

To him, I and any other gay members of society are not considered human and thus do not deserve or require human rights.

Karma is coming and it’s going to run over the dogma big time.



3 thoughts on “The Great Debate (quick)

  1. I’m looking forward to that day when “Karma is coming and it’s going to run over the dogma big time.”
    In the meantime, I feel a little bitter.

    Glad you went and took the measure of these people. It’s good to get a sense of how your own community is lining up on big issues.

  2. “So, are you then saying that gay and lesbian people aren’t human?”

    Touchè! I love it!

    BTW, when this person was “quoting works from 1962,” it wasn’t by chance that faux-psychologist Paul Cameron, was it?

    He was thrown out of the American Psychological Associaton and the American Sociological Association for falsifying anti-homosexual research, but it is still worshipfully quoted as a “scientific authority” by the Right, and he still runs the so-called Family Research Institute, to publish his lies.


    Glad the audience didn’t fall for this stuff.


  3. Hey, Michael! The name Cameron doesn’t sound familiar in that context. He did quote Margaret Mead, and much other “literature” that supposedly made his points. My point is that we are evolving as a society and so our social institutions must evolve with them. Yes, I agree that marriage-type bonding between people has been around for as long as humanity has (that was his basic premise), but how does he KNOW that various tribal groups, etc. did NOT accept such same-sex bondings throughout time. Answer, he DOESN’T know, probably because that type of statistic was tossed because it didn’t fit the “norm”. Don’t get me started. Thanks, as always, for the links!


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